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Workshop - Albion Workshop 1972 - Page 1 of 4

Verbatim Transcript: Workshop by Rhondell
Albion, Idaho 1972 – 7 CDs 

The following is as close a verbatim transcript as is possible. Dr. Bob’s laid-back
“Kentucky-ese” is retained – we haven’t corrected his grammar, dialect, or pronunciation
nor taken it upon ourselves to change his words. 

Audience (laughter) is noted; he was a master at keeping the mood up!
Audience participation is (parenthesized) and separated from his words.
Emphasized words by the speaker are in italics.
If the words were unintelligible, there’s a blank: “_________.”
[Anything that offers clarity to the reader is italicized inside brackets.]

Audio link to this workshop:

CD 1 of 7: Albion 1972

So, I don’t see anybody around that hasn’t been to a workshop before somewheres, so we won’t bother with all the preliminaries of having the Picture of Man and etcetera. We’ll start off with something that may be of a little bit of use.

Two things that we talk about from the beginning is, one: “Whenever I make anything important…” [stops to write it on the chalkboard] “Whenever I make anything important, I am anxious.”

I notice that Dave brought a little card to put on his display table back there that said “Force Yourself To Relax.” (laughter) So I feel that’s a very appropriate thing to do. I notice lots of people have made it very, very important to be relaxed and so they’re screamin’ meemies. And other people make so much important. Now as long as I make anything important, obviously I can be manipulated. Being manipulated of course means that somebody, like I or another, will force me into all sorts of operations. So being manipulated is being controlled. So whenever we’re being controlled, we are far from being free. And in this constant being controlled, it may be being controlled by a sensation. Did you ever have a peculiar little sensation, sort of an itch somewheres? And you just have to do something very drastic, you know – it’s just got to be taken care of. I just simply can’t stand this. I’ve just got to do something.

And so we begin to use all sorts of things that might possibly change it. If nothin’ else we can run awhile, we can go various and sundry places, pursue this, pursue that. Run to the doctor and take a few good pills and so that’s supposed to keep me from havin’ this itch, whatever that itch may be. Huh? So am I then being controlled?

Now then after that I go out somewheres and I get drunk and I say, “Well, I’m free to get drunk. I’m perfectly free.” No, you’re controlled. Another one says I’m free to do this or free to do that. No, that’s only being controlled. It’s only using some words to kid oneself with. You’re still being controlled and manipulated.
Somewheres along the way we have put on a class one time called “On Letting Other People Do What You Want Them to Do.” This shocks people very severely to think, “Oh how terrible it is that you’d let somebody else do what you want em to do!”

The point was we didn’t put on the talks to tell you how to go out and control people cause you’re already doin’ that unconsciously. You know you push people around all the time – you make em feel guilty, you criticize em, you reject them, you gritch, whatever the case may be. You’re doin’ that all the time.

What we were talking about was for the person to see how you are controlled. But few people saw that so it’s immaterial. So being controlled or manipulated constantly is going to be there as long as we have the Four Dual Basic Urges, which is something that we all set off with the day we were born probably. Having been floating around in a lovely little sack of fluid where nothing was disturbing, and all of a sudden find ourselves dying to that world and being born into another world which had none of the same rules of the game. So we had to find out what they were.

So immediately we decided that we knew the whole purpose of this new existence was to gain and escape. So we started runnin’ to and from. I believe somewheres it says, “running to and fro up and down the earth,” huh? Just catch who you can. So the gain was to gain pleasure or comfort, back to being in that physical state like it was back in that world of which I’ve died to but I have a vague memory of. I didn’t die willingly – I come kickin’ and screamin’ like all the rest of us, huh? (laughter) Cause I wanted to stay in that world I had been in which was totally non-disturbed. I didn’t even have to eat. Everything was pumped into a little hole in my belly.

[aside… “Be quiet, I’ll get to you later.”] So when we left that world, we didn’t like it. So we come hollerin’ about it. And then when we wanted to escape the discomfort of having change… and this is the big discomfort everbody is fearful of or threatened of today is that of change, is it not? This is what one threatens. We want to keep what we have but we want that, too. I wanna keep this, but I want that also. And sometimes they’re rather incompatible. I want my cake and eat it too, so I have a great conflict. I want to gain a non-changing state, but I want some change. So we go around and around on that one. Isn’t that right, Lee?


I want to be sure to keep all this certainty, but you want somethin’ different, hmm?


I wanna keep this situation, but I want that one also because “I do get enough to eat here and I do have clothes and so forth. And the old man does provide and pay the house rent, but then I just can’t stand him. So I want that guy over there. But, if I get him, I gotta give this up and if I give this up, my God, what will I do in case he don’t take me, you know?”

I used to have a song by Dorothy Shay [title: “Don’t You Think You Should’ve Mentioned it Before”] and she told about the guy that finally sprung on her he had a wife and kids in Kokomo. He had lived in her house and spent her money, used her long distance telephone calls, but some way he’d never called Kokomo. And finally she ended it up after her lamenting and “lamoaning” of how she had been treated by this guy who was offerin’ her the world with a fence around it but only spent her money, she said, “Maybe if I’m real nice, my husband will take me back.”  (laughter)

So I want to avoid any change which is, even though it’s a little painful, I’m afraid of change because I have a vague remember of this sudden change that occurred when I was born.

So as this goes along, we get a little further that I want to gain not only pleasure and comfort, but I want attention; and I want to avoid all possibility of being ignored or rejected. Now I can get attention any time I want; so can anybody else here. Huh? You can have all the attention you want, can’t you? You can have all you want, can’t you, Don? But in order to get it you’re liable to be ignored or rejected or told to, “Wait a minute, I’ll see you later,” or somethin’, you see. Because when you start strugglin’ to get the attention, somebody might say, “Uh-uh – knock it off.”  So you have to be prepared to have that, you see, when it comes along. But we want both, don’t we? I want to have the attention and I don’t want any possibility of being ignored or rejected.

I also want approval, but I don’t want any possibility of having disapproval. Now also, I can get all the attention I want, but I get some disapproval with it. I think most of you that know me are well aware of that. I get lots of attention, but I manage to have gobs of disapproval. And, you know, I deliberately go get the disapproval, I get the attention. “But I don’t want disapproval,” you say, huh? Then obviously you do want attention, huh? Now how you gonna get both, Bill?

(Pretty hard.)

Pretty hard. You get kinda torn up then, huh? And then we also want to feel important or useful – until somebody starts usin’ us – and we want to avoid the sense of being inferior or useless and maybe unappreciated. That’s a better word for it, you know. I don’t say, “I feel inferior.” I say, “I feel unappreciated. Just nobody appreciates me.” Do they, Jean?

(Nooo.) (giggling)

Nobody appreciates me! Well, now if I want to go out and get appreciation, I can get it but I will also disapprove of me for doin’ it, because I have to be a dog and scratch under the door somewheres to get the appreciation. I’m workin’ my tail off to go out and schmooze you so you will appreciate it. Then I go along and I said, “Bob, you sure were a nut. What do you go through all that for?” Huh? You ever try that, Norma? Work everthing to get some appreciation and after you got it you disapprove of yourself for havin’ done it, is that right? Hmm?

So we then have ourselves set up to be totally controlled and there is absolutely no freedom.  Sure you can go out and do one thing or another. And that’s easy enough – anybody can do that. I can drive 70 miles an hour down the main street in Burley and I call that being free? No, I’m trying to gain some attention and that’s all. I go out and I be one of the boys with everbody and show em I can drink em under the table or whatever the case may be; and, you know, all I’m doin’ is tryin’ to get some attention – “Lookit here what a big boy I am.”

Last New Year’s Eve, Richard King was with us, I believe, or was it two years ago, Richard?

(Two years.)

Two years ago. And all the people’s invitin’ Richard go out with em and have a drink. Several of the people who had never had a drink in their life was deciding today was the day to “liberate” and they was gonna be free now and they was gonna go drink. (laughter) And they was really gonna show how free they were and they invited Richard.

Richard said, “Ah, hell with you people, you’re a bunch of amateurs. If I’m gonna drink, I’m gonna drink with professionals, and so I’m goin’ home and go to bed,” (laughter) and that’s what he did. And the amateurs went out and thought they were free. All they were doing was trying to gain attention, trying to find something that they call pleasure, and escape some of their own disapproval. They were still being manipulated by the Four Dual Basic Urges. And as I see em another year later, the same proposition is still goin’ on – still being controlled, manipulated. Anybody that comes along can manipulate you.

Now if you want to live that way, that’s your problem, that’s your privilege. But if you do it consciously, fine – my job is finished. But if you’re doing in unconsciously, then I haven’t been able to give what I want to give.

You know it’s rather peculiar. You’ve heard of a story that a rich young man went to a person and said, “What can I do to have eternal life?” He said, “What have you done?” He said he’d lived by all the commandments all of his life. And he said, “One thing else remains – give away all you have, or sell all you have and give it to the poor.”  We’re told that the rich young man had to turn away very sadly. Hmm?

Now suppose let’s look and put this in modern day terminology. Most everbody knows that if you’re workin’ in a big business, before you can get a promotion you have to get somebody to fill your place, right Max?


You gotta get somebody to fill your place. So in order to have someone to fill your place, you have to give away all you have. So if one offers to another person a certain amount of material and says, “Here, use this” – now if you give it away it don’t mean to throw it in the good will box; it means you’ve gotta give something away – somebody has to take it and use it, right? Or you haven’t given it away, you’ve just thrown it away. So if you give something to someone and they can use it and will use it, then you can have given it away.

Now I have something that I want to give away – very much – because when I can give it away then I can progress to another job. And I want the other job if you don’t mind; I’d like it. It’s been offered and I would like to have it. But before I can do it, I’ve got to give away all I have. I find it extremely difficult.

Now I can give away my funds – that’s easy, boy, don’t you…brother! I can go work, earn American dollars – that’s easy. I can give that away just settin’ in the kitchen back here and deal em out. I took a little trip the other day to see about some business. All I run into was people who had problems. [acts like he’s dealing out money] Psh-psh-psh – you give it out, that’s easy.

But I tried to give away something else. For many years, I’ve been trying to give away something – all of it – and I can’t get anybody to take it. I see them take the words sometime and twist em around to fit the Four Dual Basic Urges. I see them use it in all sorts of strange and unexpected ways to gain the Four Dual Basic Urges. But I haven’t seen anybody that will take it and use it. Now, I’m still lookin’. And I’m not a young man anymore, so I’m not the rich young man. And I am only rich in having a certain number of things that I can give. The funds are all gone so can’t do that one anymore. But I still have something that is far more valuable than funds that I want to give.

What it is that we want to give away is the freedom to not be controlled by the Four Dual Basic Urges. That is so simple. I want to give it to somebody – anybody – that will then go use it to liberate some more people. Because as long as anybody has this, you are subject to being manipulated by anybody who comes down the street that wants to practice letting other people do what you want em to do. And if you don’t’ believe it, I’ll show you one by one all day long that I can do it.

(How do you do it?)

I can walk up to and kick you in unexpected little ways and all of a sudden you’re all torn up. You have your feelings hurt, you’re pushed out of shape. “Bob mistreated me. He insulted me. He don’t appreciate me,” and a thousand other ways you would come out with this, huh? You’ve all experienced it in one form or another mostly, huh? One way or another, most of you have.


Mostly. You found out that you’re still manipulated by anybody who wants to use it. We can offer you great rewards in the future and you’ll climb the walls. We can threaten you with an expected pain in the future of any kind and what happens, huh?

What do you look forward to, Ann? Always – a place where you will be non-disturbed. Let me go back to the world which I came from. Let me get to a state where there is no change but where there is change. One man described to me what he thought Heaven was like one time. He kept thinkin’ on it and he said, “Well, it was dark and it was very moist, it was very soft and it was quiet. But he said, “They gotta be pineapple cause I really like pineapple.” So he got pineapple in this world and he wanted to take the pineapple back to the world where he came from and I think his mother objected so he had to ____________. [laughter and side talk about the pineapple]

(Couldn‘t take the pineapple!)

Couldn’t take the pineapple. And those things are kinda spiky, you ever notice that? So always the person gets in this struggle. Now we would like to give – to someone who wants it – the greatest gift in the world because it is utter freedom. It is being one – that you are no longer manipulated by anybody. You are truly free not to go out and do this, that, and the other, which is only kidding yourself because that’s your only catch in this one. We hear people use this for ever conceivable sorta thing: “Well, we are free, aren’t we? Let’s go ahead and do it.” No, that’s only “I want to gain pleasure and I’m gonna use this terminology in order to try to get it.” And of course that’s far from being the use of it.     

The point is, am I through with struggling to gain pleasure and escape pain? Am I through with trying to gain attention? And if I wanna gain it, I can certainly go get it but know there’s a little price on it, huh? I can get all the attention I want and get some disapproval with it, too – never a problem. Or I might even get some pain, who knows? I might even get some approval for it in one minute, but I’ll never know what’s gonna be in the next one, huh?

I can certainly get some approval, but I’m also probably lose one or two others – it will cost me something, maybe every nickel I have. You know if you go give somebody 50 bucks they usually approve of you for at least 15 minutes; not 50 minutes, but 15. And then tomorrow they want another 50 [bucks]; and if you don’t deliver then, then they’re mad at you. But… immaterial. So you know where you’re going to be. Are we inferior-to-unappreciated? Yes, we probably are. But is that all the necessity? Hmm?

Now if somebody walked up to you and jammed a knife at you, it’d probably frighten you a little bit, huh? And if he said, “Give me all your money you got and I won’t hit you with this knife,” you’d hand it over, is that right? Because you want to gain this and escape that over there. [points at the 4 Dual Basic Urges on the blackboard]

Now if you were beyond that stage, you’d probably tell the guy to put his stupid knife down, or who cares, or you wouldn’t be frightened. A man who’s trying to threaten you with a knife or a gun and you aren’t threatened, he sure is in a bad position, did you know that? He wonders what happened, everything went haywire; he gets confused and runs away. We have seen this happen. No, he gets confused and runs away. But what difference if he pulls the trigger? Still tryin’ to be safe? So what? (laughter) You weren’t always here; the world got along fine before you got here. Are you gonna let some joker with a little gun in his hand or a knife manipulate you? Hmm?

(I think I’d allow the manipulation.)

So you want to be manipulated? So very few… how many of you have been manipulated with a knife or a gun lately? Not many – in fact, in your life. But you have been controlled, your temper’s been on rampages, you have been down in the dumpies because somebody didn’t approve of you. You’ve been all torn up because this didn’t happen or that didn’t happen. Hmm? Some change took place – things aren’t like they were last week. Hmm? Things went different; all of a sudden my whole security is threatened. Now security is hopin’ that you’ll have a certain amount of this and this and this [pointing at the board]. “I’ve had a little of it and I call that security.” Of course, I always want more when I got it. But when it’s gone – that little bit I had – then I call that the security and I wanna get it back.

A man and his wife fights and scraps for years. One day she says, “Aw, to hell with you,” and gets up and leaves and he is utterly devastated, he can’t live without her. He is absolutely torn up because he gritched about her all the time while she was around, you know, but now that she has rejected him and left, he just simply can’t stand it. He can’t live without her.

Do you ever, any of you, experience that little situation – one side or the other? Hmm? Any of you ever try it? Have you ever been gritchin’, gritchin’, gritchin’ about your so-called mate – the person, you know, you share as they say “bed and board” with – and all of a sudden they reject you. Did you find that you suddenly thought a tremendous amount of em and look what you have lost? It was so essential to have them; it was just unbelievable, huh?

So are you manipulated mornin’, noon, and night? Are you manipulated by the sensations that arise within the body? Hmm? Are you manipulated by the sensations that arise in the body, which are gonna be there the rest of your life as long as you live – most every time? Except when you are totally unconscious from anesthetic or something, you will be manipulated by the sensations that arise.

Are you manipulated by the people you come in contact with? Are you manipulated by other drivers on the highway, those Hoosier plough-jockeys that run all over the street and don’t get out of the way and let you go? Are you manipulated by people who is in front and drivin’ ten miles an hour less than what you want to travel? Huh? Are you manipulated by the weather? Are you manipulated by about ever conceivable thing there is in this world that we live in? Hmm?

Now if you wished and could see that you are totally manipulated, totally controlled, you have absolutely no freedom no matter what you do because all you’re doin’ is tryin’ to gain one of these and get back from the other. So a sensation comes along and I feel kinda romantic, so I decide then I can go out and have all this romance I want cause “I’m free to.” Uh-huh…I’m only bein’ manipulated and usin’ the word I heard to kid myself with. That’s all. So that’s nothin’ wrong with romance. Say, fine, I want some romance but don’t holler about all the “free” to it. Just look for the appropriate partner that suits you and go. I don’t care. But you don’t have to holler you’re “free to.” Everybody who’s a joker in the world knows that. You know. Just look around – we’re all here. (laughter) So, obviously…huh?... everybody’s free to do that. You don’t have to attend class to hear about that. That’s just the most obvious thing in the world.

I can rob a bank if I’m big enough and smart enough, but that’s doin’ what? Being manipulated by one of these, feelin’ that if I have the money then I can do all sorts of things: I can embezzle, I can defraud, I can take advantage of, I can do anything I want to, yes, but that’s all just pullin’ one of these or tryin’ to avoid one of these. That isn’t freedom at all.

When I can so live that I am no longer manipulated by this and this, then I might talk about freedom. I probably wouldn’t but I could probably talk about it a little bit. I might could see what freedom means.

Now does anybody want it? The gift is here, it’s yours, and I would like for you to take it. But now the takin’ is not just to sit around and stick it under your pillow. It must be used with other people to allow them to see the possibility that they can be free.

Then you see I can understand why this man in the story walked sadly away. It’s dammed hard to give it away. And I can see he probably couldn’t follow the master into the regeneration for a long time to come. I can see where he probably saw that he may never get to. He’d probably die of old age before he could give it away because he couldn’t get a taker. Now that may be a little different approach to that little story than usual. You know, we usually only look at things one way. And wasn’t he a greedy kook? And now I would a give it away if it’d been me. Uh-huh.

Maybe you can’t give it away, hard as you might try. And then you would have a reason to walk sadly away, right Max? Huh? You’d have a very good reason because you can’t give it away and you can’t go as long as you have it. [someone starts to talk] Wait up. You’re still tryin’ to get attention. We’ll give you plenty of time for it when we get through, but right now I’m getting’ the attention. (laughter) I certainly don’t have your approval and I don’t want it.

So you see that while we go along we’re tryin’ to give somethin’ away, not gain approval.

So when you see how this works, you might could see “I am totally manipulated, totally controlled and there’s only one thing I want is to get out of that. And I don’t know any way to do it, so I can’t struggle to be relaxed; but I might see that I totally am and there’s nothing I can do about it so I quit fightin’ with it.” But at least I would quit kidding myself and saying I’m free every time I do something that I formally had as a taboo. You know, I wouldn’t call that freedom. I’d just see, “Well, I’m still being manipulated and there isn’t anything I can do about it.”

When one does this for a very short length of time – which very few seem to ever want to do – then there is in that freedom to be manipulated. That’s the first one you come along with, you know? You’re not strugglin’ to get out because when I tell you you’re manipulated, immediately that’s kind of a disapproval, isn’t it? And you’re feeling inferior, and already the heads just goin’ all sorts of ways, “What can I do to get out of that?” In other words we’re going to force ourselves to relax, huh? But it comes out that I’m still strugglin’ away at it.

When you see that you are in a given state, first you “Confess” – I believe is the word that sometimes is used in pretty terminology – which is to be aware that I’m in this state. And I am totally – not just partially – but totally manipulated by sensation, by other people, by the weather, by the environment. And any kind, any thing that comes along manipulates me cause I just react all day long.

I see that there isn’t anything I can do about it. That’s called “Surrender”, I believe.  And the next thing is to see that there’s one thing you don’t want is to go through life as a total manipulated little gadget that anybody can kick this way and the next one kicks it that way. It’s like a bunch of kids goin’ to school kickin’ a beer can. That’s about the way our existence goes, huh? We read an ad and we run buy somethin’. And somebody else says, “Well, you’re a joker for doin’ it.” And I wonder how I’m gonna get rid of it and I take it to the flea market next Sunday and try to sell it so the neighbor won’t know about it. And this goes on and on and on. So we’re kicked.

So the one is to see what I really want. I only want to get out of this. I want to be an end to this manipulation – that I’m totally manipulated and I don’t know how. That’s called “Repentance”, I believe: turning about.  

The fourth one is something that is done for you – you can’t do yourself. This is as far as you can go. The fourth one, I believe, is sometimes been referred to with the beautiful word “Baptism.”  You’re washed. But you see, somebody else only does the washing; you don’t do it. And you don’t know where it comes from, but some mornin’ you wake and you see the joke of havin’ struggled away and spent your life struggling with this. It’s a joke.

It’s like you saw the joke of bein’ left down in the swamp to hold the sack to catch the snipe that somebody was gonna chase in while they all went back home and went to bed. Left you out in that cold, eerie swamp all night.

You see the joke and then you have seen the truth. And to see the truth is to see a joke, and you kind of laugh. And if you ever notice when you laugh you don’t have a thought one in your head.  It’s totally peaceful. [Says, “I’ll be there in a minute, okay?” to someone.]

It is a joke to see what a terrible joke “I” played on I. And as soon as one sees this joke, then comes what is called a Baptism, somewheres along the way. It doesn’t mean somebody takes you out here in the creek and dumps you. It means that you are cleansed off of being wrapped up in this. Now, you have accepted a gift and you can then use it. Now the next step is you use it.  You don’t just sit there and look at it and say, “Heh heh heh, I got it,” because it has to be used because the gift is not being given unless somebody takes it and uses it.

Now when this is seen then you can work with any troubled person in the world because ever troubled person in the world is troubled over one of these, is that right? Any of you ever been troubled?


Never. Okay. How about you, Walter? Have you ever been troubled? And was it over one of these?  You were afraid you’d lose something you thought you had, or you wouldn’t get something, or there would be a change comin’ up and, “How in the world am I gonna get it back to this state that I had it before,” is that right?

You ever been troubled, little one? And was it over one of these? Have you ever been troubled, dear Anne? Huh? And it was all about these. And could most anybody come along today and manipulate little Anne almost any direction… you wanna stay that way the rest of your life or are you damn tired of it?

(I’m almost.) (laughter)  

Almost! And anybody can come along and manipulate you. Something can arise in the body and manipulate you – huh? – anybody that comes along and offers a reward or threatens you with a future punishment that they can control you? Huh?

(I don’t know right now what it’d be like.)

That’s right. So you’d be like… you still want all those. So you want to go ahead and be manipulated, so I can’t give it to you, okay? But it’s available, dear. You change your mind in two minutes I’ll gladly give it to you. How bout you, Vito? Huh?

(I’m getting tired of it.)

But you have you still goin’ with it.

(I’m interested, still.)

Huh? And do you see that all the things that you’ve called “problems” all your days – sittin’ right here? Now we don’t have to go into all this long philosophical discussion and take obtuse philosophical ideas and run them up and down the alleys. And we don’t have to take theological concepts. We don’t have to take all the great psychology learning and delve through all the psychology books in the world. It’s very simple. It’s so simple, it’s sittin’ in front. But do you want to be free with it, Bill, or do you want to keep on livin’ by it?

(I want to be free of it.)

And that’s all you want.

(I know how I want it.)

You know you got it – 100%. You can’t do it by degrees, I’ll assure you this. Now everbody would think, “Well I’m a little more free than I was last year.” (laughter) You’re not a damn bit more free than you were the first day I saw you because I can still go out and manipulate you with ever one of em.

Hence people said, “Bob is a terrible person – he manipulates people.”  You better believe I do –  cause I want you to catch on. I will make you squirm ever once in a while, yes. And if you’ll let me, I’ll do most anything to you. I’m doin’ it so you will see it. I’m supposed to be a mirror and I’ll stand and show you over and over that you’re manipulated. I can twist you, turn you any way. If nobody else does, I’ll do it.  Of course, everybody else is doin’ it but they’re so gentle with it you don’t notice. I’m not very gentle with it – you catch on. I hope.

So when you see – are you livin’ by this? “I’m 100%.” I can’t do anything about it, which is Surrender. And the third one is I see that’s the one and only want I have – nothin’ else. That’s all I want. Now of course most of us want this and want that. Now I want this, but I want to be sure I have the house paid for, and I want to be sure I’ve got the car, and I wanna be sure my job is secure and I wanna be sure the income is taken care of, and I wanna be sure that everbody loves me; and then I would gladly have this. (laughter) Oh no, no…no, no, no, that’s not the way it works.

You take it or nothin’. That is when one has Surrendered and Repented. The Baptism will take care of itself. Okay? That’s the gift that will come along when you can do the first three. Now the first three are your own little things:

#1 to see that you’re totally manipulated,
#2 to see you can’t do a thing in the world about it,
#3 to see there is only one thing in the world I want: I wanna be out of that noise.

That’s an infant, that is an animal, that is even a plant; I’m not being a human being. And I don’t care what else I do without or what else I have or anything else, I just wanna be out of that one.
Now if I put all the conditions into it and say, but I wanna be sure I’m loved, and I wanna be sure I have this, and I wanna be sure of this and certain of this. And then I will do that. But somewheres along, somebody said, “You seek first the kingdom of heaven and all this other junk will be added unto you.” Now we want to jump first and assured we got it and then we’ll take it.

But now that is the three steps that one can do. The rest of it will take care of itself. Okay, we’d like your questions, dear.

(All right, let’s get back to Jesus here.)

I never was there to start with, so we can’t get back there, I’m hung here. And I’m here, not there, okay?

(All right. You came here… or the parable goes that this man, you said, “Give away what you have –)

No, “sell” all you have, dear. Sell it for money and then give the money away. It wasn’t give the poor people stuff; they wouldn’t know what to do with it.

(Well what I got out of this analogy here was the taker did not have what Jesus was giving. So therefore, how could he –)

Well now, wait a minute. It said he was a rich young man, so he had something that he had to give away; then he could progress. You better go read the story first.

(I see.)

Don’t waste your time otherwise. Nick?

(On number two and number three, there is nothing to do about it and #3, um –)

I can see what I want. I can see what I want. The only thing I want… there isn’t anything I can do about what I want, but I know what I want. You know if a person truly knows what they want they 90% got it. But usually we want two things, Nick, at the same time; and of course then we never get anything but conflict. I want my cake and eat it, too. So there’s nothing there that you could do about it, but you know what you want.

(That was the third step?)

(I want to be free of being manipulated.)

I wanna be out of that noise, right. And I know what I want, and that’s all I want. If I do got that then the rest of it will take care of itself. And I don’t know how to go about it, so I won’t be interferin’ in the process by tryin’ to do this or that or the other, which would only be trying to jump from one side to the other, yes. Okay? So one becomes peaceful even while one is still manipulated.

Did you ever consider if somebody put you in jail and locked the door and you weren’t tryin’ to get out, you’d just as soon be there as anywheres else, he sure isn’t punishing you worth a hoot, is he? And he gets awful disgusted with that. And they say angels come and unlock the doors. They’ll throw you out.

I had a friend who was arrested in the state of Ohio for some grave charge like doin’ something illegal. He was a doctor and wasn’t goin’ along with all the rules of the game; but he had a thousand patients. So they put him in jail and ever day the patients came in droves to visit him – like four, five hundred of em a day. And of course the third day they said, “Get that guy outta here.” He had a six-month sentence for the practice of medicine without a license.

So he said, “I have to serve and pay my debt to society. I will stay here until the last day of my sentence is paid because I’ve always paid all my bills. The state says I owe a debt to society of six months; you will have to keep me in jail so I can pay my debt to society.” The next day over a thousand people came to visit him. And they literally bodily drug the man out of the jail, (laughter) but he sat on the front door step every day all day long for the six months. And thousands of people came to visit him. And you can be assured he was never arrested again (laughter) and he went right on with his rat killing. But he would not leave the jail – except at night he did go home; they wouldn’t let him in to sleep so he did go home at night – but each morning early he arrived and sat on the front steps. And thousands of people came to visit him. Every day, all day long there was a herd of people came. And you can be very sure they didn’t decide that they knew how to punish somebody who didn’t mind and was free to be manipulated.

You see, we think about being free, and then we struggle to be free. But the first one is I’m free to be non-free, huh? So you got me tied up, I’m manipulated. All right, so manipulate me. Have fun. You’ve already started on the road then. Something begins to happen. I don’t know how to do it, but it begins to happen then, you see. Okay, another question, please. You had one.

(You said you started on the road. But before you said, “Well you’re no freer than you were before.)


(These two comments seem to be in conflict.)

They are not in conflict. I have at least seen that I’m in jail. Before I can get out of jail, I have to realize I’m locked up, huh? And I’m no more free once I realize I’m locked up than I was before I realized it. Is that right?

(You gotta be closer to being...)

We’re no closer; we don’t know. We’ll wait and see. We’re not talkin’ about closer. We’re still locked up. Okay? And being closer or further away don’t seem to make much difference. I almost made a thousand dollars last week. (laughter)

(Oh, boy…)

But I just missed it one time. (more laughter) It was real close – I had a close miss there. And I found a thing that was almost an orange, but it wasn’t. Now, whatcha got, Leigh?

(All right, now I’m…umm, uh… birth. We do not participate in the birth process –)

Go ask somebody. You’ve been through it haven’t you? You got kids; don’t you know what started it? Don’t ask me, girl, I haven’t had one yet.

(No, we are closed in this confinement, this _____.)

Right. You go get an incubator and look at an egg and see what gets that chicken to start peckin’ inside. Then you come back and ask your question again. What you’re trying to do is say, “I’m not responsible for being born.”  But you go check it out, dear.

(No, what I’m trying to find out is…)

You’re here.


Okay, let’s start there.

(All right. I want to be here apparently. Otherwise –)

Well, now that’s pure speculation. That’s pure speculation, has nothin’ to do with the situation; you’re here dear – unfortunately. (laughter) But you see it’s totally irrelevant to go back and start philosophizing. This is the way to leave the issue: is to “why” I got here, how come I was born, how come conception took place. You can philosophize on that from now till doomsday, and I’m not interested and I won’t buy it. 

(You won’t listen to me.)

Right. When you start talkin’ what’s here now, I’ll be listenin’. When you start tryin’ to pull me into philosophical discussion, I won’t hear you. That’s clear enough.

(So you made a statement that we didn’t want to be here.)

I didn’t say that.

(Didn’t you say that?)

No, I said we kicked and screamed when we came in. We wanted to maybe to stay where we were because we like non-changes.

(Well, that’s what I was –)

You’re still goin’ by it. Okay. So go figure it out, dear. We’re not interested in philosophical discussions and lookin’ for explanations because for ever explanation there is at least two more that’s just as valid as the first one. Okay? And we’re busy trying to give somethin’ away, not go through long philosophical discussions. Thank you.

(Thank you… I guess.)

Okay? Any questions, please – about here and now. We’re not interested in theories, philosophies, etc. Those are… you can do that year in and year out. There’s gobs of time and place to do that. Drinkin’ parties is a good one.

(There is a question.)


(Uh, I recognize – very graphically – that I’m in that area, right –)

Cause you’re controlled – totally manipulated. Anybody wants to push it or any sensation, any weather or anything, okay?

(Some more than others, I agree. Okay now. I want what we’ve been talking about.)


(I want to be free from that.)

Okay. What else do you want?

(Well, that’s the area that there is still the questions roaming around.)


(Do I want to earn a living? Do I want to –)

Well, you’re always in doubt about it. You’re earnin’ a livin’ and everything, so you go ahead and earn a livin’ and want that as far as I’m concerned. 

End of CD 1 

CD 2 of 7: Albion 1972

[CD 2 begins by repeating the last few seconds of CD 1]

Drinkin’ parties is a good one.

(There is a question.)


(Now I recognize – very graphically – that I’m in that area, right?)

Cause you’re controlled – totally manipulated. Anybody wants to push it or any sensation, any weather, or anything, okay?

(Some more than others, I agree. Okay now, I want what we’ve been talking about.)


(I want to be free from that.)

Okay. What else do you want?

(Well, that’s the area that there’s still the questions roaming around.)


(Do I want to earn a living? Do I want to –)

Well, you’re always in doubt about it. You’re earnin’ a livin’ and everything, so you go ahead and earn a livin’ and want that as far as I’m concerned. But do you use that... what do you want? You see, most of us want this and this and that.

(I want to know the experience of it. I haven’t experienced it so I don’t know. I don't know how – )

The only way to find out is what?

(Experience it.) (laughter)

Good. Don’t ask me. Try to get me to tell you what an orange tastes – go eat the thing and then you’ll find out. I can’t tell you what an orange is – go eat it. Hmm?


You see we would like to philosophye ourselves into freedom, sir. Man has been philosophying for centuries to be in freedom. It is only action that you will find out because you can philosophye and you’ll come up with an answer of some kind, won’t you? And that will satisfy you until somebody comes along and challenges it.

(So it doesn’t specifically matter which jail you’re going to stay in as long as you know you’re there.) 

Right. You’re in it and it doesn’t matter what the name stuck over the front door is, does it?

(So if you change –)


(jails, you’re just……)

It just transfers you from the state one to the federal one. What difference does it make? 

(Living conditions maybe.)

Well, I don’t know, but maybe more and more comfortable or less comfortable, but it’s still a prison. And you’re still here. [Pointing to the Four Dual Basic Urges] And there’s only one way you’ll find out is by action, not by theorizin’ about it. Is that right, sir? 

When you can walk up and see if somebody criticizes you or jabs you with a knife a little bit – verbally – and see it if it tears you up inside, then you’ll find out whether you’re still being manipulated. Otherwise you can philosophize, and theorize, and take all sorts of questions, and you can read books, and you can attend organizations and when you get all through you will be what?


Manipulated. Okay, that’s all we’re interested in right now. Next question please? About here and now. About action. We can philosophize to why the human beings were even originated in the first place. I don’t know – we are, you know. And your theory’d be as good as mine and mine would be as good as yours, because I don’t happen to have one. I think we descended from somethin’ else. I said "descended" not ascended either. (laughter)

(If you realize that you are manipulated and you send a message to X that you don’t want to be manipulated, you want to be free of these, is it, the reason –)

What’s your reason?

(Is it that –)

So you’ve done decided you know what to do, just send a message to X and then it’ll get you out of it so now you know a “how.” And I said we don’t know how, okay? Cause you don’t know whether that’ll happen or not. If you did, you could demonstrate it and you wouldn’t talk about it, is that right, dear? You see again, we are philosophizing. And we are sayin' send a message to X. In the first place we don’t know anything about X, wouldn't know how to send it a message nor where to send it to – with Western Union? (Laugher) So what? Maybe I haven’t even got the loot to send the message. And if you leave me to send it, why I’ll assure you it won’t ever be bothered with. I’ll take the fee and not bother with it. The point is, you see, you’re assuming you know something to do about it, Jean. 

(No, I really don’t.)

Well, so then you wouldn’t bother to send the message cause otherwise you think that’s the way to do it, don't you? 

(I didn’t get the answer to my question.)

Yes you did. You got the question, you got the answer and you forgot what the question was – that’s the whole problem.

(No, I didn’t forget the question.)

The question was, “You send a message, would that get it done?" And I’m sayin' that’s figuring out how to know what it was doing. And you’re figuring out that you know how to go about it. "I’ll just send the message to somethin’ I refer to as X and then it’ll take care of it." Let’s go through the things that we’ve said:

#1 – again – that we recognize we are manipulated.

#2 I don’t know anything about how to get out of it includin’ where to send the message to X or Garcia or anybody else. (laughter) Huh? I don’t know anything about sendin’ a message because if I sent a message it’d just be trying to get one of these. [points to the board]

And the third one is that we would see the only one thing I want is to get out of there. Okay? And I don’t know how in the world, where it can be done, whether X can do it or whether time does it or whether there is a demon does it. I don’t know. I don't know what happens. That’s all I can do, okay?

(But you have to see it clearly, right?)

That you are truly manipulated. You want a demonstration? I will be happy to provide that. It let's me work off gobs of my aggressions, you see. (laughter) 

(I can’t say I’m going to see “self”.)


(I’m going to see and then I will be free because I will –)

No. I didn’t say a thing in the world about it. I only said can you see that you’re totally manipulated. That’s all I can. And you can see that you're totally manipulated. Second, can you see you couldn't do a thing in the world about it? And third you see what you want. But that's the part that’s... don’t say we’re looking for freedom.

(Any seeing I would do would be somwhat ____.)

That may be. No doubt. Go ahead. You see we’re not interested in motive at all. We’re talkin’ about a discovery of something, dear – we’re not talkin’ about strugglin’ to force ourselves to be relaxed at all. We’re talkin’ about merely recognizing that there’s machines in us. Huh? There’s no motive involved in it. I see it. I see a lovely lady sittin’ there – no motive involved in this at all, yet. (laughter)

Okay? Questions? Let's take about –

(Let’s take a break on that!) (laughter)

– five minutes break.

[after break]

It takes up the time. You know everbody feels that you gotta have a certain amount of time to run a workshop – about 15 hours, 8 hours. When I first come along I believe there were like 30 hours, then I got em down to 15, 10. Now we got it down to one. So we will comment a little bit on this one.  

We will look and see some of the more common ways that we are manipulated. Some of the things you know we are quite well aware that we are manipulated by either sensations within, other people, the weather, etc. But basically, there is a lot of subtle manipulations that we’re not aware of. So in order to be aware that we are 100% manipulated, we’ll talk about some of those for a little bit. 

First thing to start manipulation about if I want to manipulate somebody is that I set up an ideal. 

Teako come along one day and he and I were havin’ a little conversation over here at a table and he was tellin’ me about some of the things he had been working on. You don’t mind if I use this, do you? It’s just em-bare-assing, but that’ll be alright. (laughter) 

So he told me some of the things he’d been strugglin’ with to achieve these great heights of whatever it is that man's lookin’ for. One of em was that he could sit totally still like a statue. Now in this case the statue of course is much better than a human being – it can sit totally still and never flicks an eyelash. And so Teako had been trying it; and he found the more he tried it, the more he itched and the more he wiggled and of course, he had great problems then as to how he could achieve this “still state.” 

I told him I could help him – very quickly – that all we had to do is hit him on the head and he’d vomit. (Laugher) And then we’d move farther. But he didn’t think he wanted that way to achieve this ideal state that somebody had laid on him, somewheres. 

But you see the minute that we set up any ideal that I will give you pleasure or comfort... it'll be painful if you don't, I'll give you attention if you do it, I'll ignore you or reject you if you don't, I will give you approval if you can sit still for one hour and never flick an eyelash. I’ll give you approval. Isn’t that wonderful? (Laugher)


Marvelous. You have achieved, you have something to work for, a goal now to force yourself to relax. (laughter) Then I can escape all disapproval. I won’t disapprove of you if you can sit there for an hour. But if you only make it 59 minutes, you got a long way to go. You give up just before pay dirt; and I’ll tell you then, you will be over... oh, you will be superor because there’s very few other people that’s quite that numb in the world. (laughter) Then of course if you can't do it, you’re inferior. Huh?

Now I heard somebody else come along and "You pray without ceasing." Well that’s a goody, you know? Now I've got a little story for you: you gonna pray without ceasing, hmm? And if you can do it, I’ll give you great rewards; and if you can’t do it, you’ll have eternal damnation comin’ upon you.  

I laid down the pain and offered you the pleasure and now then you’re gonna try to do that and still you got to look after squallin’ kids, clean houses, work, earn a livin’, buy the groceries, go to the grocery store, do the laundry – all these things, huh? Now how you gonna manage that? How would you do that, Bill? I don’t know... you could give up, go get a bottle and hang it up, huh? (laughter) Go get a fifth and call it a day. (Laugher) "All right, I tried, I’m just a failure, I just don’t have any good in me at all.” But now come on and we will get you there if you come with us. 

Now let’s all take a little look at some of these subtle little ideals that we have laid on us, huh? Now let’s take one that’s not so subtle. Let’s take “happiness.” [Writes on the board] Hap-pi-ness. Now if you have happiness, you have everything. And there is ever reason for you to be happy. And I'll write a few books under various names and each one of em will have a different author's name and I will write “how-to’s” and sell em to Prentice Hall and they will publish em and you’ll buy em all, hmm? 

But pretty soon, what is happiness? It is having that when I have this – I think is the way it finally turns out, is it not? Is that what happiness is? Nick, do you know what happiness is?


I don't know either. [he addresses someone else] You should – you know everthing.

(Well I certainly do – that’s what makes me happy!) (laughter)

What is it, love? That's something you know. There’s the way you see. Give or take somethin’ away from it and give it back (laughter). Jerk the approval back one minute, then give it back to her. Top of the world. (laughter) So then is happiness is having what you don’t have? Is that about the way it comes out? Hmm?


What is it, dear?

(Happiness is something that emanates from within, not something you can find.)

Where is it, where do you get it from within? All I’ve seen come out from within I didn’t want to be bothered with. (laughter) That’s what they have a Sanitation Department for. (laughter) Right?

Now, it sounded pretty. You know... somebody said, "well you can find it within.” Look within, right? If Teako could sit perfectly still for one hour and never flick an eyelash, hmm? And you can just go in there and find it, okay? I have been in there lookin’ around inside these human bodies, so I’m not so sure I wanna know about it. I've been in there lookin’ around through em.

So what is happiness? Now we’ve all been told about it and we’ve all struggled for it. You been tryin’ to be happy, dear? How have you succeeded, dear?

(I haven’t.)

Haven’t made it, but you’re still workin’ on it, dear, cause the ideal is to be happy, huh? And we’re told if we have love we’ll be happy, so we go lookin’ to see if we have love. And sure enough, I don’t know whether you love me or not. I'lI make ever effort to see that you don’t. (laughter)

But basically we wonder about it over and over and over: “Does that person love me?” Probably not. It really doesn’t matter one way or the other but probably not, they probably just enjoy you or they have pleasant sensations around you and so therefore, you’re used, you know. So you’re not really loved at all. (laughter) So if I can just have happiness though I would have everything. 

So the ideal is held out for happiness and happiness is that which you don’t have. If you spend enough money in buyin’ up things or you do enough litte exercises or you do enough this or do that or enough people treat you a certain way then you will be what? Donna?

(The same way you were before.)

Just miserable and still tryin’ to get it. And no matter what anybody does or don’t do, it’s not quite enough. 


So then we have this little ideal set up: “And if I could only struggle towards happiness.” So any ideal is an illusion. And you know what an illusion is? That’s something that I can visualize but there is nothing there to base it upon. In other words it is a inside job, you know. (laughter) It's like everthing else you got in there – it's pleasure. (laughter)

The illusion is something that we generate within and then we struggle toward it. Now most anything can be set up as an illusion for you – achieving a certain exercise, achieving a certain weight. (laughter.)


She used to run a weight class, you know? She wrote three books on how to lose weight. (laughter) She’s only gained 15 pounds since she wrote the books.


Fifty. Before then she was just plump, now she’s plain fat. (laughter) 

So anyway you can struggle towards the illusion. The more you struggle the better it comes, you see. So what is the major illusion that one is looking for?


Slenderness in one case. Allen, you don’t even try that anymore. He's found to look prosperous. (laughter). He found if he just puts enough tailor-made clothes over it, you can cover it up and make it look wonderful. (More laughter) Now he is got ________ very much. He’s very pleasant to look upon.

Allen and I go to the same slot joint to get our clothes, and we have a little fun down there. They are great on deliveries. (laughter). I went down the other day and said, “Look 90 days ago, 92 days ago I ordered four shirts from you. I haven’t seen a shirt.” And they just give me a whole bunch of excuses and I said, “I didn’t come here for excuses, I come here for shirts.” "We know that." [he makes noises like they’re embarrassed] I said, “Well, I’ve forgotten what the shirts look like, and I probably haven’t got anything to wear em with now after all this time, so just give me some ties. You got a bunch of ties hangin’ there; I’ll take those instead of the shirts.” “Oh, we can’t do that cause the shirts were made for you.” I said, “I know, but I’ve growed since then, they wouldn’t even fit me.” (laughter) "I don't want em!" So we played games for a while and I had a little entertainment and left. I still haven’t got the shirts though. It’s immaterial. But some fine day I’ll go on a trip somewheres a long way and then I'll call em collect. (laughter) 

(You would, too!) (laughter)

You better believe I will. So they told me to – call collect. They thought I’d call from up here. So I’ll go along and get em to send em to me sometime. You know you do get fun out of these things, whatever you do. 

But now the ideal would be that everbody does what they say they’re going to do. Now that's... that's gettin’ with it. Now then I could live with it. People would be honest. (laughter) And after all there’s two people in everbody and one of em says one thing and the other one does somethin’ else. And you know that as well as I do. 

So how do you expect to make your illusion is that everbody’s gonna be honest with me and they only tell me what they’re gonna do? “Twelve years ago he told me he is gonna do so and so and now look what he’s doin’!” Hmm? Right? Is that right, sir?

(Three months ago.)

Three months ago. (laughter) Heard a man talkin’ the other night. I, as I said, I went in a very funny little restaurant because I didn't wanna drive anymore so I hunted up the only one I could walk to. And there was some people having a conversation and it was quite a long, involved theological discussion which both of em decided that they wasn't real sure whether anybody knew what happened after they left here.
And one of em said well, he really wasn't interested because there'd only been one perfect man and he got nailed to a cross and he didn't wanna be perfect cause he don’t wanna get nailed to a cross. The other guy said "Oh, there was two of em, two of em." He was sittin’ there with some lady and havin’ dinner and the other guy was standin’ up in the aisle talkin’. And the guy that said, "No, there was two of em," was the one sittin’ there with the lady. And the other one said, "Who was the other one?" And he said "Well, it was my wife's first husband." So (laughter) you see once he’s gone he become the paragon of everything now. And the old boy finally had it pretty well figured out: "My wife's first husband – that was the other perfect man.” And he didn't get nailed to a cross. He just ...(still laughter)

So we have these various illusions that we pursue to have. As... one is to have security. Now that is a beaut. Do you know what it is? 

(Security blanket.) (laughter) 

What is security? Now tell me about that, huh?

(Linus’ blanket.)

Linus’ blanket, but sometimes they have to launder it and he is in panic. So he can’t have it either. What is security? Did you ever work for that, Anne? That’s an illusion. What is it? What’s it consist of? 


As long as it was easy. (laughter) You really had an illusion, dear. (huge laughter) You really had an illusion. Now what else could we come along with that we have? How many have struggled to have security? Did you ever work for that one, too, along with happiness? Happiness and security...

(The family. You know... the family, togetherness.)

Family, togetherness... togetherness. And man, when you get em all together, we stay dispersed, huh? (laughter)


Then it goes on. So what we want is an ideal is what? “This” and “that” – at the same time. I want this and that. Because as we went along with listening to the things that various and sundry people offered as this, or they offered... some other bunch offered this one over here, is that right? Now most of it have both sides of it. Then we decide we want two different things. Now I want pleasure, but I also want freedom. Now I want security and I want freedom. Now let’s try that one on.

(Oh boy! That's a good one...)

Now the best security that I could conceive of is get a life sentence. Only now they throw you out after 8 years, but you still haven’t got it. But if you had a life sentence that could not be commuted in a federal penitentiary, you’d almost be secure for as long as you live because you have free medical service, you have free bed, free room, free meals, free plumbing, and free clothes.

(Free companionship.)

Free companionship is always there and everthing – you got the whole works, *** but you don’t have any freedom with it and now you experience that. So now but if I want both, huh? What am I lookin’ for? 


Impossible. Now then of course, I don’t have the ideal, huh? You want both? Would you like security and freedom?


No. What do you want?


And if you want freedom, then you struggle to get it, huh? Do you think you know how to get it?


You don’t. Okay. And freedom would only be the point of [At this point there is a 6 second pause in the CD and then picks up again a few sentences back. See *** above.]

but you don’t have any freedom with it and now you experience that. Now but if I want both, huh? What am I lookin’ for? 


Impossible. Now then of course, I don’t have the ideal, huh? You want both? Would you like security and freedom?


No. What do you want?


And if you want freedom, then you struggle to get it, huh? Do you think you know how to get it?


You don’t. Okay. And freedom would only be the point of not being manipulated within. But now as long as I have these [Four Dual Basic Urges] can anybody come along and offer me somethin’ here? Or I can even imagine that if I had something that I would have all of this and escape all of this. I can imagine something or I can remember some big day when I lived back on a farm in Kentucky. It was one Sunday afternoon, Mama was gone from home so everthing was quiet and peaceful. And I can remember that little bit and I think, “Just to live on a farm back in Kentucky again, hmm?" Wouldn’t that be happy. But man, you go back and look at those joints. Mmm! I don’t want no part of it.

But that is happiness. Many of you have some vague remembrance of a time when you were really happy, like your first boyfriend when you was in junior high. Man that was a thrill, wasn’t it, Anne?

(Yes it was – the bloom of the grammar school!)

Right. And it was like it will never end. This is the enduring thing. But some way or other, next week it was altogether somebody else, huh? So then this goes on and on for the ideal.

Now tell me some ideals that you have. Nick, how about you startin’ off here? Let's have a little energy.

(To find God.)

So what is God, first off? And would that be somewhat of an ideal? Then that would make you have all of this, no doubt, and escape all of this if you found God, is that right? Because He is all powerful, he can give me _________ .

[16 second break in the original tape and content was lost]

Well, all right but wouldn’t that be an ideal? Or it might be the most horrible thing that ever happened to you. It might be that a human being in this state of existence was to come in contact with what he refers to as God it might be devastating to him to say the least. Do you ever think of that possibility?

(Yes I have.)

So, then you wouldn’t know whether it was gonna give this or this or that over here. Now seems that God comes into being when man has peace of mind – a reality. You could call it God or you could call it “truth” or you could call it somethin’ else. But it’s not something you find because that implies that I’m smart enough to chase it down. 

And it may occur to the individual and come hunt you when you are worthy – worthiness meaning not that I’m good enough or so forth, but that I am, shall we say, to the point of being without “knowing.” Which was the things we went through in the workshop the last hour, is that right? It said something like: I see what shape I’m in – I’m totally manipulated. So everthing I do is manipulated so something manipulated me into lookin’ for an ideal. I don’t know how to stop it and I can see that one thing I want is to be unmanipulated.

Then it’s possible then the person has a little bit of what you would call being humble. “I don’t know how.” You see, what being arrogant is, “I know how to do everything.” Hmm?

And here comes up the one thing that the person maybe truly wants and you don't know a thing in the world how to get it. You have to come up just a little bit on knowing what humility means, huh? It doesn’t mean walkin’ around like a “bum” or anything; even Mr. Ridge can be humble in his satorial glory, you know?

And when he and I dressed up, why we put on a fashion show and all that but we could still be humble – that has nothing to do with it – knowing that I don’t know how to approach this ultimate reality that man, that a few men, have reported there is. And that man seems to have some kind of feeling within that all of this when he looks at it is so much what? Kinda “trashy”, isn’t it? It’s really not worth pursuing. But I don't know how to go about the other. That would be a little bit of humility, wouldn’t it? Huh, Nick? Do you know how to go about findin’ God? 

The one thing you truly want, you haven’t the vaguest idea how to go about gettin’ it. If you want a law degree you know how to go get that. If you want a bunch of money you know how to go get that. If you want some attention you know how to go get that. If you want some approval you know how to go get that, but do you know how to get the ultimate? You really don’t know that one, do you? Okay?

And you wouldn’t know what it would be like cause you’ve never tried it, so you wouldn’t have the foggiest – it just sounded good, maybe, somewheres along the way after I tried a whole bunch of other things that I could get like attention, approval, and even felt important, superior to a whole bunch of people. And it still left me with an awful void within. So, I think there is something else and so I would refer to that as "God" and pursue that for a while. 

That is probably... I believe it can get around the next bush before you can catch there. It might be like that bluebird that you can catch as soon as you can sprinkle salt on its tail, huh? Have you ever caught it, Anne? Ever found God? Been lookin’? But before you started lookin’ you formed a concept of something it would be like. And was it not that it would have all of these and there would be none of these, dear. Hmm?

And we formed a concept of a heaven. Somebody holds us out a heaven, and it’s a place where you have all of these and they hold out at the same time a hell that that's where you get all of these, you know? Huh? That about right?

Now would any of us pursue much of any studies or, shall we say, practices or philosophies that didn’t hold out a reward or threaten you with a punishment for not doing it? Would you spend much time on that? So then your whole struggle for all these higher thoughts supposedly is for what purpose? Manipulation of the Four Dual Basic Urges. That’s about how high it got off the ground, is that right? Is that right, Anne? Would you have pursued anything that don’t offer you a reward in the future and threaten you with a punishment in the future, huh? You wouldn’t bother with it. So, then, this is the height of your great higher endeavors, is that right? Great value, isn't it? Infantile urges. Okay? Let’s take another ideal; what’s one of yours?

(Well, isn’t that what we’re doing when we...when we, you know –)

It’s very possible that that’s what you’re looking for, but it may not be that that’s what it'll be all. We said it would be freedom and freedom to experience whatever life brings: it won’t stop the snowstorms, it won’t stop your toes from gettin’ cold, it won’t stop people from being gritchy. Huh? It won’t do things like that, see.

But the point is would you even feel it necessary for all that to be changed, do you see? Huh? The world will go on just like it is, even if you were not controlled by these... that you weren’t manipulated by. 

But It’s not a reward cause you don’t know how terrible it would be, do you? I've told you that you did do happy, didn't I? But It’s just simply that here I am, supposedly an intelligent human being, and I’m staying sound asleep instead of being awake and lookin’ around. I wanna find out. Then I could investigate all sorts of things when I’m not manipulated. But then do you investigate or do you just accept or reject when you’re manipulated by this? Can you investigate anything or do you merely accept or reject when you got this? How about that, Anne? Can you truly investigate or do you merely accept or reject on the basis of ...


That's all it is, isn't it? So you really haven't ever investigated anything. So being supposedly Homo Sapiens, which means man thinkin’ or man looking – man being – then we would start being a little bit to find out what it’s like. It may be horrible, honey, may be terrible, may be you wanna run back to this, I don’t know. But you could always go backwards, couldn’t you –  after finding out whether you can investigate or not. You wouldn’t get hooked out there, you could always come back. With these, you’re hooked here. You’re in prison – that right, hmm? You’re hooked. 

(It’s a lot safer there.)

Is it safer where? Right here? How safe is it, dear? Huh? You have it. You like it that way, huh? So you want to stay there? That's fine. You don’t know whether it’s safe or not because I’ve noticed it’s fatal to everbody that stays there. It’s like drinkin’ water; they all die. That we’ve noticed, huh? Got a question now?

(You said that you can always go back. You can go back to being asleep, but you can’t go back to the exact conditoning.)

No, but you can go back to the state of tryin’ to struggle to gain the pleasure and escape the pain using all this, you can always struggle – any day you want to. Nobody locks you out from anywheres. 

But just for the simple curiosity of findin’ out what it’s like to actualize the potentials we have, it would seem it would be well to live one day, at least, without being manipulated. And if we didn’t like it, wanted to be manipulated, we can always go back to being manipulated. Is that right? Very much helped by anybody who wants to push a button. Is that right, Anne? Nobody keeps you up there if you don’t like it. You could live one day without being manipulated. Then if you’d rather be manipulated you could go back to it with the greatest of ease.


Right. Okay? So there’s nobody would dish you out any trouble. Just to find out what it would be like to live one, 24-hour day without being manipulated, we’ve never known that, is that right? 

Now most of us are totally unaware of being manipulated. That's also correct, right? Now of course we work, struggle towards ideals as though they were real things. We struggle towards illusions as though they existed. We talk about things that nobody knows about as though they were just as clear as the lines in the palm of your hand or yesterday’s newspaper, is that right? Hmm? And you don’t know one thing about it except somebody stood up in a loud, clear voice said thus and so. Huh?

Most interesting, I was with some "prophets" this past week. They are very proficient at telling people, “I suddenly received an impression and you must do this.”  "Your children are in great trouble and you got to do so and so, and you’ve gotta do this and that." So Wednesday afternoon I was sitting in the motel down in Albuquerque and I get a frantic call from one of these prophets. He said, “My car is lost!” 

I said, “How in the world do you go about losin’ a car? They’re pretty big devices.” (laughter) He says, “Well, another lady,” who is also a prophet – the wife of a prophet –  “went downtown in the car, it run out of gas, she pushed it off of the street and she don’t know where it is.” 

I said, “Well, that should be absolutely no problem in a household like this. I will come out with a vehicle and take you to it, but while I’m on the way, would you please just get one of your direct impressions of where things are. Let the “Spirit Guide” lay it on you and then we can drive straight to the car.”  (laughter)

Now there was several minutes of intense silence on the other end of the phone and then it erupted. Would you like to hear what erupted? It wasn’t very nice; but would you like to hear? “Bob Gibson, you son of a b, you bubble-bustin’ bastard! (laughter) Get the car!" 

And on the way, it was decided we won’t ever play this game that “I know all this stuff” anymore, you know. I like to bubble bust and I’ve been waitin’ to bust that bubble for 12 years. (laughter) I’ve been waitin’ patiently for 12 years to blow that one. 

When there’s something you can check up on, they’re out of business. As long as you can’t check up on it, “Oh man, I'm in business, ain't I? I can tell you what you were in your former incarnation or what you were in your pre-existence. I can tell you where you’re gonna be in your next one, but you can’t check up on it.” 

But let’s lose a car; now we’ll both tell me where it is. Let’s check up on it and see if you got it. Hmm? Tell me about it, man. And these great beings couldn’t deliver one little bit. We just had to go drive up and down the streets. Thank goodness there’s only 18 streets that run east and west in Albuquerque. So I tried all the major ones, the 18 majors, and I started on the side where they were and worked south. On the 4th one over, I saw the car down the way. Now this was just plain old experiment to find the car. But there wasn’t anybody that could tell me where that car was – not even the person who lost it. Hmm? Did you ever lose a car?

(I dream about it all the time.)

You have dreams of it, so you lost it. 

( _________ parking lot.)


Well, at least you knew it was where it was, it was in the parking lot. In this one, she didn’t know where it was. She wasn’t even sure it was still in Albuquerque. So it would be a little interesting to see where and what these might be.

Now as long as we have an ideal, and an ideal is always the idea that these can be all achieved and these can all be avoided. [gaining and escaping] Now obviously let’s take a look: What we call pain is merely a sensation that you experience when there’s something damaging to the physical organism. X reports that there is sensation that says "This is destructive." I go back there and work in the kitchen and stick my hand on the saw, I’m awful glad it hurts. Now I’ll never be in a state where I will be absent of pain, huh? Unless I don’t have a being anymore; and I don’t wanna be in that state.

Always somebody is gonna give me some attention and somebody’s going to ignore or reject me; why? Because people have tastes, hmm? I like one wig and I don’t like the other, you see. I like Donna’s little hat and she don't because she wanted to go launder her hair, roll it up and get it all pretty and I told her she could cover it up with a hat and nobody’d see it. (Laugher) 

So there’s always a matter of taste there. Somebody gonna approve of me? Yeah! Somebody gonna disapprove of me? You better believe it because there’s gonna be different behavior on my part from time to time; and the other person has maybe at the same time different tastes at a different time. Same person gonna approve of me one day and disapprove of me another? We’ve all experienced that, haven’t you? Who cares? It’s just their opinion. So I will never escape this while I have a state of being, huh?

Now we could postulate some great state where everbody has the same taste, but well, I wouldn’t wanna be there, would you, Ralph?  

( _____________ )

Yeah. But I wouldn't wanna be where everybody had the same taste. They’ll not all have the same taste you have, you know. So... Perfect for you but I wouldn't want it. So I'd like to be in a place where there were different tastes; and if there is diferent tastes, there’s bound to be what? Some approval, some disapproval from time to time, huh? Smebody approves of you one time–

(Sure would be a funny world if all the guys in the world liked just one woman.)

Woo woo!


They’re bad enough when only two like the same woman. You noticed? Bad enough when only two liked her, much less one. Oh everybody would – man, it would be unbearable, no doubt. Huh? Maybe the rest of them’ll all die and you can find out, honey.

(Promises, promises.)

Promises, promises... I didn’t promise it; I couldn’t make it. That would be some kind of a heavenly state, you know. But do you see that we can set up any ideal which is an illusion to struggle for? Now, is there such a state as being without sensation and still being conscious?


Then, obviously you’re going to have sensation – all this approval is I sense that somebody says, “I like you,” or “That’s a pretty suit,” or “I like your weird tie,” or “I like your hair,” or “I like your behavior,” or something. That’s all it is, is a matter of them expressing their taste. It expresses absolutely nothing about me. Did you ever realize that? Somebody says, “I like you.” They’re only telling you something about their taste; they’re not describing one iota about you. Hmm? Don’t get the big head over it cause all they’re telling you is what? 

(Their taste.)  

Their taste. Not a thing about me. And they walk up and say, “I can’t stand you,” they’re not saying one derogatory thing about me; they’re only expressing their taste. Hmm? They haven’t said a thing about me, and I take it as though there wwas somethin’ serious. Huh? (laughter) Isn't that right? And they haven’t said one iota about me – they’ve only expressed their taste and I feel everbody has perfectly freedom to express their taste.

So if somebody walks up to you and says, “I love you,” all they’re doing is telling you that they have a taste that they approve of you at the moment. Hmm? Huh? Well, whatever. It might just be polite, who knows? But It’s their statement of their state, not a thing about you. Is that right?

And if I say, “You are the most lovely creature in the world,” I haven’t told you a thing about you, I’ve only told you about me. Is that right? You see we’re always talkin’ about ourselves and other people talk about theirselves. And we have one form of insanity (laughter) called “ideas of reference.” Did you ever hear of “ideas of reference”? Everthing that’s said is about me and I get all pushed out of shape over it, over my particular brand of insanity. (laughter) 

She says, “I can’t stand him.” Well she’s just expressing her taste; she’s not talkin’ about me at all. She’s only tellin’ about her taste, is that right? And if I have “ideas of reference” which is a very severe form of insanity, I assume she’s talkin’ about me. "She said somethin’ about me." She hasn’t said one thing about me. She’s only told me about her taste at that particular moment. Tomorrow she may like me, we don’t know. It’s accordin’ to like a while ago, or the future, you didn’t approve and in a little while I told her she knew everything and she said, “Now you’re seeing it like it is; I feel wonderful, ” you know? So it's a what? She only told me somethin’ about herself, not a thing in the world about me. And is there anything...

End of CD 2


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